SCA Laurel Sovereign of Arms
Online System for Commentary and Response

Site News
Sub Status



Create Account

MAIL ME my password.


[ Site News | LoIs | KLoIs | SENA | Prec | AH | Track | Sub Status ]

Ansteorra LoI dated 2018-03-09

Greetings to the Sovereigns and College of Arms!

This letter contains submissions from Ansteorra Kingdom ILoI dated 2017-01-31 and ended 2017-03-01, which can be found here: Unless otherwise noted, the submitter has no desire for authenticity and allows any changes.

The Kingdom of Ansteorra humbly submits for registration the following heraldic items:

This item was on the 06-2018 LoAR

1: Ingrid Biørnsdottir - New Name & New Device

Per pale embattled argent and gules, a bear rampant sable and a tree blasted and eradicated argent.

Submitter desires a feminine name.
Language (Norse) most important.
Culture (10th - 14th Century) most important.

Ingrid - Lind col. 638 sn. Ingiriðr

Ingrid_, Ingeridh_, Norway, 1454.

Ingrid found in Withycombe, pg 162 - "Ingrid is a feminine Old Norse name"

Bjørnsdottir - Bjorn - From OW.Norse bjorn, which in turn derives from Primitive Scandinavian "bernuR, bear". An extremely common name in West Scandinavia, originally derived from a by-name meaning "bear". Viking Answer Lady (Http://

Lind col. 145 sn. Biǫ rn has for examples in the genitive case:

Biørns, Norway, 1368 (checking Lind's source, it appears in the patronymic of Lafrinze Biørnsson s%)

Bjorn - Geirr Bassi pg 8: 42 instances of the name used in Scandinavia. Bjorn can be found in the Academy of St Gabriel report 2935


dottir - meaning daughter of of Bjorn ( s.n. <Bjorn>

NOTE Submitter would prefer <Bjørnsdottir>, but it was suggested in commentary that <Biørnsdottir> would be more appropriate, so it has been changed in Kingdom. Additionally, submitter prefers <Ingrid>, so this was also changed, per ffride's commentary, which can be found at

This item was on the 06-2018 LoAR

2: Kilian MacRaith - Resub Device

OSCAR thinks the name is registered as Kilian Macraith in January of 2005, via Ansteorra.

Quarterly argent and vert, a Celtic cross counterchanged between two tortoises vert

This is a resubmission from an item that was returned in the April 2017 LOAR.

Kilian Macraith. Device. Quarterly argent and vert, a Celtic cross counterchanged between two tortoises vert.

This device is returned for violating SENA A2C1 which states that "Elements must be drawn in their period forms." This depiction of a Celtic cross with thin untapered arms does not match the ones we are currently registering and as such would need to be documented to be registerable. The submitter provided an image of a 10th century cross with reduced tapering of the arms. However, it does not match the submitted depiction. There is some visible tapering of the longer arm and all arms are significantly wider than the annulet portion.

Previous submission can be seen at:

This item was on the 06-2018 LoAR

3: Llewellyn Brydydd - New Name & New Device

Azure, a gauntlet fesswise grasping a drawstring bag argent

No major changes.
Language (Welsh) most important.
Culture (16th Century) most important.
Spelling ("Brydydd") most important. leuan lloyd brydydd dated to 1406

"The last element in your name, <y Prydydd> means "the poet, the composer". The word <prydydd> was pronounced PR@-d@dh, where dh represents the sound of <th> in <this>. We have found several examples of this byname in period Welsh names:…Ieuan lloyd brydydd (1406) [4]…Welsh occupational bynames normally do _not_ include the definite article <y> when they directly follow the given name of the person they describe; but usually do include it when they are used without the given name… Reference [4] Roberts, Glyn, "The Anglesey Submissions of 1406" in _Bulletin of the Board of Celtic Studies_, vol. XV pp.39-60."

Llewellyn in "Late Sixteenth Century Welsh names" by Talan Gwynek

Geiriadur Prifysgol Cymru has (s.v. "prydydd"), 1547 WS [A Dictionary in Englyshe and Welshe, ed William Salesbury, 1547], prydydd, a ryme maker. Amongst citations going from the 12/13C through to 1803. It also says: Fe'i ceir fel epithet, e.e. Meilyr Brydydd, leuan Brydydd, Hir. Cf. hefyd Prydydd y Moch, y Prydydd Bychan. [It is found as an epithet, e.g. Meilyr Brydydd (Maelir the Poet), leuan Brydydd Hir (leuan the Long Poet). Cf. also Prydydd y Moch (The Pig's Poet), y Prydydd Bychan, (the Little Poet)]

Concerning presumption, from Tangwystyl, via Adelaide:

Although issues of rank and status vary enormously across the medieval period, I'd be hesitant to set aside any of the various Welsh poetic bynames as making an inappropriate claim to rank. Let me put it this way: the early medieval Welsh laws list as a royal official the "court smith" who has a set of rights and perks associated with his office. But that doesn't mean that "smith" is a restricted indication of rank. There are several occupational terms relating to composition and performance that appear in the law tracts, including "pencerdd", "bardd teulu", "bardd cadeiriog" all with different duties and rights. The later poetic treatises (largely written at a time when all official function had ceased -- they were the intellectual games of independent artists -- mention a number of other terms and are far more interested in applying minute distinctions of rank than the law tracts were, at a time when they had essentially no authority to enforce those distinctions. But I digress…

There are a number of bynames meaning poet that appear during an era when they wouldn't have had any sort of legal status. The different bynames probably had distinctions of meaning for the people that used them, which we can only guess at from their historic connections.

Prydydd -- The literal meaning is "a maker, a composer". Famous examples tend to be associated with "the poets of the princes", that is, people whose recorded works were praise poetry for native Welsh rulers from around the 10-13th centuries. The byname may or may not have been understood as implying an official position--it may simply have been a description of their most notable achievement. Examples of prydydd as a byname can be found throughout the 13-15th centuries in contexts for people who aren't associated with courts (or when there were no courts to be associated with). It's found in both lenited and non-lenited forms. Morgan & Morgan's book on Welsh surnames has a discussion on reasons why lenition is variable (and why it appears at all) in bynames of this sort. The short version is that some bynames always lenite, some apparently never do, and some are variable.

Bardd -- This is, of course, the most recognizable of the bynames and one with a long history and broad use across the Celtic languages. When indicating what appears to be a formal position, it is typically modified in some way (bardd teulu, bardd cadeiriog, etc.). The late-period poetic manuals treat it as a formal rank, but as I note that was at a period when there wasn't actually any formal structure to apply it to. There are examples of bardd used as a byname by people with no special position in records of the 13-15th century. It appears in both lenited and non-lenited forms.

Clerwr - I don't have any examples of this as a byname. The poetic manuals treat this as the least prestigious of the poets, possibly even slightly derogatory.

I don't believe that "awenydd" was used as an occupational term in period (though I don't have my historic dictionary in front of me). It generally means the abstract concept "poetic inspiration".

So to sum up, if your client wants prydydd, that would be appropriate in meaning, is found as an ordinary occupational byname across a range of eras, and to my mind does not have any implication of rank or status when used all by itself. As it is found in both lenited and non-lenited forms in historic documents, he can probably pick whichever he likes. If you follow Morgan & Morgan's interpretation, it may be that the lenited form implies that you're distinguishing from someone else (which Meilyr? Meilyr the poet) whereas the non-lenited form is simply descriptive (Meilyr…you know, Meilyr the poet).

This item was on the 06-2018 LoAR

4: Llewellyn Brydydd - New Alternate Name

OSCAR is unable to find the name, either registered or submitted.

Hakon Gunnarsson inn grai

No major changes.
Language (Norse) most important.
Culture (The) most important.

Hakon - Geirr Bassi, p 11

Gunnarr - Geirr bassi, p10

-sson, dropping one "r" adding the suffix <-sson> to create a Patronimic, p17

Inn Grai - Geirr Bassi, p22

NOTE In checking Geirr Bassi, we noted that <inn grai> should not be capitalized, so that was changed in kingdom.

In Service,

Elena Wyth


OSCAR counts 2 New Names, 1 New Alternate Name and 2 New Devices. These 5 items are chargeable, Laurel should receive $20 for them. OSCAR counts 1 Resub Device. This item is not chargeable. There are a total of 6 items submitted on this letter.

[ Site News | LoIs | KLoIs | SENA | Prec | AH | Track | Sub Status ]

Site Copyright © 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2011, Lewis Tanzos